The optimistic title to a recent Catholic News Service article states, “U.S. priest trusts Christian unity is possible.”
Highlighted therein is Philadelphia native Monsignor Gregory J. Fairbanks (pictured above with Pope Francis and Cardinal Koch), who specializes in dialogue with the Baptists at the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity in Rome.
After joining a group of local clergy and pastors who met monthly to share neighborhood concerns and find ways to better work together, he [Msgr. Fairbanks] says he “realized that if the ministers cannot work together, then our people are not going to be able to.”
If you’re wondering what Catholics and Baptists working together on neighborhood concerns has to do with the Church’s mission vis-à-vis her relationship with heretics, the answer, of course, is not so much.
But wait, it gets worse.
“We have to learn what people actually believe, learn where they are coming from, and then learn how we can come together in faith,” Msgr. Fairbanks told Catholic News Service.
Well, two out of three’s not bad; it’s downright pathetic.
Sure, it’s important to know what heresies an individual or group might happen to embrace, but the notion that a priest of the Holy Catholic Church must in some sense “learn how we can come together” with them is wholesale nonsense.
The priest, if he actually thinks and feels with the Church, should already know how we can come together; if he doesn’t, then he should probably be on the other end of a conversation with someone who does.
To state the obvious, the only way Baptists and Catholics can come together unto the “unity” toward which Msgr. Fairbanks imagines he is, or at least should be, laboring, to quote Pope Pius XI, is for…
“…the separated children [in this case, the Baptists] to draw nigh to the Apostolic See, set up in the City which Peter and Paul, the Princes of the Apostles, consecrated by their blood; to that See, We repeat, which is ‘the root and womb whence the Church of God springs,’ not with the intention and the hope that ‘the Church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth’ will cast aside the integrity of the faith and tolerate their errors, but, on the contrary, that they themselves submit to its teaching and government.” (Mortalium Animos)
According to Msgr. Fairbanks, the Pontifical Council has had its share of successes.
Baptists and Catholics were able to agree to a common statement about Mary, church leadership, the word of God and the Bible. “If I had been asked 10 years ago if the chapter of the role of Mary would ever be written between the Baptists and the Catholics, I would have said no,” Msgr. Fairbanks said.
While a professional ecumenist might consider a “common statement” such as this a magnificent breakthrough, from my perspective, it’s clearly no great shakes since the Baptists remain separated from the solitary Ark of Salvation.
Indeed, it would appear as though the only concrete result of this common statement has been … wait for it … more dialogue; i.e., it’s little more than just another day on the ecumenical treadmill to nowhere.
Even so, Msgr. Fairbanks said that the ultimate goal of ecumenism is not uniformity but “full visible unity,” and he explains that as “full communion with each other, fully shared Eucharist, and full sacramental sharing.”
He went on to say, “The point of the ecumenical movement is to have a common witness for Christianity so that we can more effectively share the message of Jesus Christ with the whole world.”
On Friday, I sent a message to Msgr. Fairbanks asking him whether or not there is any possible way for this unity to be achieved other than that which was articulated so clearly by Pope Pius XI, but as of this writing I haven’t received a reply.
In any event, the bottom line is this; an ecumenical movement that has as its “point” the common witness of which Msgr. Fairbanks speaks is truly point-less.
And why?
Simply because the message of Jesus Christ includes the glorious reality that He entrusted the fullness of truth to the Holy Catholic Church alone; it cannot, therefore, be effectively shared by those who refuse to enter her.
Simple logic? You bet, but no one ever accused the modern day ecumenical movement of being logical.
The World Council of Churches receives lots of foundation money — like Rockefeller Foundation, Ford Foundation, etc. As we learned in our previous discussion about ecumenism “in the beginning” there was a secret meeting between Dr. Visser ’t Hooft [the first general secretary of the World Council of Churches] and Cardinal Bea in 1960. The only Catholic organization that the big foundations give money to is called “Catholics for Choice”. This is a bogus group with no membership which is propped up by the foundations in order to promote the killing of babies in the womb and at the same time to attack the Church. OK, so using a little bit of logic here and your “sensus fidelium”… do you think the World Council of Churches is a friend of the Catholic Church or an enemy? Ecumenism seeks to grind down the Church into just one more Christian denomination and then just one more “faith community”. And Jesus? He becomes just one more “prophet”….
Thank you for your excellent blog.
I no longer seriously entertain the notion that these prelates are faithful but misguided. I believe a few at the highest levels are infiltrators and the rest are pliable faithless fools who value obedience (even if its false) over any other virtue.
Along this line, I believe that false ecumenism and other conciliar novelties should be viewed as akin to computer viruses. To those who are poorly catechized EENS seems extremely cruel and parochial. For example “People who pray to and serve Our Lord can be damned just because they don’t hold all the dogmas of the faith?” The traditional Church teaching – that to please Our Lord above all we must hold the faith – seems alien to an epoch awash in free-thinking liberalism.
Those supposed change agents who infiltrated the Church on a mission to destroy it are not like modernists who just want an “updated” Church. No, the change agents may be dead-set on the destruction of the Church. Note that if they are only interested in the destruction of the Church they don’t care whether their heresies are dogmatically proclaimed either. Further, they have Our Lord giving them advice – de-emphasize those hard teachings of Our Lord to such an extent that those who honor them (“rad trads”) will appear as fundamentalist lunatics.
So how else have the change agents attacked the Church – by assigning new disciplines to the faithful that seem innocuous on the surface but which are really antithetical to the faith. Sand in the gears so to speak. That is why I liken the novelties to computer viruses. So now we have to dialogue with those caught in heresy and be respectful to them because it is assumed that the heretics hold their views in (sarcasm) “good faith”. How do these false disciplines NOT create cognitive dissonance in both the individual minds of the faithful and their collective mind. Dissonance then becomes division and the Church falls because a house divided against itself cannot stand.
Now that is not how I see things – I merely disagree that the Church cannot fail because there will always be a faithful remnant. Nonetheless, untold numbers of souls have their salvation placed in jeopardy because these false disciplines are corrosive to the faith of those souls.
“The priest, if he actually thinks and feels with the Church, should already know how we can come together; if he doesn’t, then he should probably be on the other end of a conversation with someone who does.” One fine day!
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The msgr said, “we have the same Scriptures, the same belief in Christ.” well, that’s a lie to start with. we don’t have the same scriptures, the protestant bible is missing a few books and has lutheran redactions in it. I do recall at the end of the Apocolypse a curse being issued by St John upon anyone who took anything away from scripture. As for Marian agreement, I wonder what the ‘common statement was’? That Our Lady’s name was indeed Mary? now the statement by Frankie not so long ago (although this pontificate feels like it has been dragging on for a decade) questioning the sinlessness of Blessed Mary ever Virgin is fitting into the scenery. Plus no protestant except for Eastern Orthodox believe in the Real Presence. So no, not the same belief in Christ.
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all of the above is simply satan doing his usual work of dissolving the ground of Truth only found in the Church. Having been raised protestant in different ‘denominations’, I can honestly say that protestants believe that Catholics are wrong and deluded pagans. It’s that simple – so when they ‘dialogue’, they are actually hoping to convert Catholics away from Truth to their own lies, long and short. The new ecumenism is simply anti-christ, no question; it is anti-truth and anti-church, and as, Michael said, ‘seeks to grind down the Church into just one more Christian denomination and then just one more “faith community”. And Jesus? He becomes just one more “prophet”….’
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the silly thing is that Truth IS and can’t be disappeared – the only question is how many people will hold to Christ in the face of satan’s diabolical dialogue?
Under Bergoglio, the N.O. Church is so ecumenical, it includes martians!! Check article on Google–Pope says Baptism is also for Martians! Of course, this would not include Traditional Martians!! Every time Bergoglio opens his mouth, I wince!
heheh – traditionalist martians need not apply. however, all others willing to be unconvinced of their God-given Faith, come on in! but wait, you don’t have to come in because there’s no in or out anymore. so, liberal martians, stay where you are – it’s alllllll guuuuud.
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p.s. when viip catholics talk about ‘baptism’ these days, I do have wonder exactly what they mean? do they mean baptism as Pius X and St Peter would have understood it, or something else? is it a metaphorical baptism that was already given in a universalist and immaterial way as jpii taught? or something even more extraterrestrial?
is it just me, or do you think this martian bid is frankie’s ‘segue’ to presenting scientologists his new brother bishops?
The servile expression on the face of Monsignor Fairbanks says it all about this ecumania: it is founded upon human respect (and therefore, contempt of God).
I am sure you know of Lutheran Bishop Francis W. Palmer and his connection to Pope Francis. You probably have seen this video, but just in case, here it is. It may help understand the direction of ecumenism. The Pope has a statement at the end.
http://wn.com/francis_w_palmer
Scientologists believe there are extra-terrestrial beings with souls out there?
i’m not entirely sure, but it was my understanding that they believe that they come from an extraterrestrial super-race or something. they have levels like freemasons, so this little whammy doesn’t hit them until they have invested much of thier good sense down the drain of idiocy, just like freemasons, really.
off topic, but on topic – This from Mundabor:
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http://mundabor.wordpress.com/2014/05/13/meet-francis-the-presbyterian-pope/
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“These are interesting times for Michael Voris, for sure.” You got to admit, if you want a quotable, go to mundy.
dear brethren,
as one commentor to this video states, many of the youth have been deceived all there lives. I wish , If I may say, to thank Mr. V., and all of you here for breaking down, with a huge chainsaw, the deceit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfbHq67u2xY&list=TLeSSLCM4ZO7num6B_YmC7mM9Ir1MzrN4l
a better link to the above
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfbHq67u2xY
“many of the youth have been deceived all there lives”. that’s true. as a convert I approached the Church through the vital tradition still very much evident ‘outside’ of the vii makeover and so knew the difference.
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p.s. re the Remnant – they just sent this email around:
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Big Trouble at The Remnant’s Site
“For the past several months The Remnant has been transferring its entire online presence over to a pro-life and pro-family web hosting company. As of this week, there was one component of our operation left in place from the old system: Our domain name is still hosted by a company based in the UK. Thus we find ourselves at the moment rather desperately attempting to discover why this UK-based company locked down The Remnant domain name and caused The Remnant to virtually disappear into cyberspace this afternoon.
These days, as the persecution of all things Christian heats up, we can only speculate as to what might be going on. But before going there we’re giving this company a chance to “fix” the problem.
In the meantime, please pass the word along to family and friends that our site is down and that we are not even able to receive email at The Remnant’s usual email addresses. Either wait until the site is restored (please God, later in the week) or use this emergency email address: remnantmatt66@yahoo.com Any email sent to us over the past 24 hours may also never reach us. So, please, after our website is restored resend those emails.”
my dear salvemur–thank you for the heads up.
The Church cannot any longer – using its own logic in favour of ecumenism & panreligionism – object to Satanolatry. Nor can it disobey the First Commandment, then say it is bound by it. A Church that acknowledges the Will of God only when it suits it do so, is not a Christian Church, but is Godless. Voris, in his video “Black Masses and Pluralism”:
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqfdrSM80kg
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is spot on, except that things are even worse than he thinks.
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There is no logical reason, given its current practice, for a Papacy that can tolerate prayer with heretics, schismatics, and pagans, not to include adorers of Satan at Assisi as well. This is what comes of the false ecumenism of V2. The principles of that ecumenism are unChristian – so its results turn out, sooner or later, also to be unChristian. STM V2 is slowly, and painfully, unravelling.
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Or did JP2 propose to act against the teaching of V2 ? If his behaviour was intended to be in agreement with it, it is entirely fair to blame his panreligious & fake ecumenical doings on V2. If, OTOH, he was disobeying V2, & acting contrary to it: why was he canonised ? Logic and reason are not going to stop existing & working merely in order to avoid embarrassing the V2 Church and its bad ideas.
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Ecumenism, regardless of the theory in the V2 documents, is pluralism of religions, and is becoming pluralism within the CC itself. Not in theory – or, not in theory until it becomes a fact. Until then the theory is that the CC is does not allow plurality of religion within the CC. But this is slowly beginning to change. I can easily imagine an ecumenical/pan-religious satanic Mass being offered in St Peter’s. There are always reasons to justify evil, once one forsakes the guidance given by the Faith. I’m beginning to wonder – and this is not a pleasant thought – whether JP2 thought of himself as the founder & prophet of a new religion, a sort of Improved Catholicism, free of Tradition, that was subject only to the will of the Pope.
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The Church formerly taught that it was a sin to join in the prayers and services of a false religion. It still is – it can’t not be, since, regardless of Rome’s “variations”, the prohibition on doing that is based on truths of the Faith that have not changed, and cannot change.
Unless of course the first 1960 years of Church teaching were so much eye-wash. But no V2 cleric can say that w/o denying the infallibility of the Church – the very thing that got Father Hans Kung in trouble 40 years ago. The hierarchy today is composed, in part, of Father Kungs – such bishops act as though the Church were deeply fallible in matters of faith and morals, even though they deny in words that it is fallible. Vatican II is unravelling – and the process is very likely to be both prolonged, and very painful.
If it is not wrong to attend such services now, the Church has been misleading the Faithful for most of its history. It has been teaching extremely fallible doctrine. If OTOH it was not in error then – it must be misleading the Faithful now, and encouraging them to commit sin. How are those of us who are not Vatican theologians to square this circle ? Rome never ever ever helps us do so – it merely behaves as though no problems of theological principle or of continuity in Faith were involved. That is a fat lot of good.
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From the South African bishops in 1998:
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http://www.interchurchfamilies…
The title is GUIDELINES for EUCHARISTIC SHARING in SOUTHERN AFRICA. The Catholic discipline that denied the Blessed Sacrament to non-Catholics is, in effect, dead; or dying the death of a thousand qualifications. In view of this steady dilution and falsification of Catholicism, it’s not easy to see why excommunication should be a big deal. Fake ecumenism leads to lack of respect for the penal law of the Church: as a little forethought would have shown the Fathers of V2.
“Scientologists believe there are extra-terrestrial beings with souls out there?”
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If Xenu is evil (as they say), he must have, not necessarily a soul, but somethoing that functions as one. Here’s the Prophet (Profit ?) Elron on the subject: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwfxuQtgGE0