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The non-negotiable Charter of Newchurch

Louie,

It has been suggested both here in the comment section, as well as to me privately, that the real issue with Fisher More has to do with the way in which the content and impact of Vatican II is treated at the college.

Whether that means via curriculum, or simply the general attitude of the faculty, is unclear.

Blog for Dallas Area Catholics, for instance, has suggested that the problem concerns college president Michael King, who is allegedly “taking an increasingly severe stand regarding the Council and the changes that have occurred in the Church in the past 50 years.” (I resemble that comment.)

Whether or not this is all or part of the problem, I don’t know, but it certainly rings true.

It’s important to realize that the non-negotiable Charter of Newchurch is the text of Vatican Council II; ambiguities, misrepresentations and all of the confusion that comes along with it. It’s their version, or better stated, perversion, of the Oath Against Modernism.

Those who refuse in any way the required lockstep acceptance of the whole kit and kabboodle all but invite ecclesial sanction, even to the point of jeopardizing one’s claim to “full communion,” unless, of course, one happens to be a heretic in Catholic clothing, in which case one has all the qualifications necessary to be a card carrying New Evangelist.

This just so happens to be the primary reason the Society of St. Pius X is on the outside looking in, juridically speaking, as summed up well by Bishop Fellay:

“So when Pope Benedict requested that we accept that the Second Vatican Council is an integral part of Tradition, we say, ‘sorry, that’s not the reality, so we’re not going to sign it. We’re not going to recognize that’.”

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: I wouldn’t sign such a statement for the simple reason that it’s simply not true, or as His Excellency said, “that’s not the reality.” Much of the conciliar text is indeed an integral part of tradition, but some of it isn’t, and the utter failure of the post-conciliar popes to clearly distinguish between the two, condemning the latter as a danger to the faith, is precisely why the Church in her visible structures is crumbling at our feet this very day.

As for the suggestion that Mr. King and some of the parents and faculty at Fisher More are having trouble getting along, that’s a pity, but since when does the Church consider withholding access to the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass from Catholics who are under no canonical penalties a disciplinary tool?

Oh, yea… since “crypto-lefebvrean tendencies” and the Pope of the People came along.

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Comments (42)

  1. Louie, I don’t understand the content of the Dallas Blog. If one is a traditional Catholic, how could one NOT criticize “the Council and the changes that have occurred in the Church in the last 50 years”?

    I also understand that the local FSSP clergy threw tantrums when Father Gruner visited the campus (I presume he gave a talk but I don’t know that for certain). They claimed that Fisher-More College had invited a suspended priest (Father Gruner) to the campus and there was a real ruckus made.

    Good Lord, it’s all so depressing.

  2. I have heard that charge leveled at Fr. Gruner before and am not sure why. In other words, what charge or charges were brought against him, what Church official or agency suspended him, and who signed his suspension papers?

  3. Were I to be interrogated by our cardinal here in Boston as to whether or not I accept the novelties, nuances as well as the false ecumenism and religious liberty thrust upon us by the VII insanity..my answer would be an emphatic resounding no!!! I’m fine with not being in communion with modernism. Thank you and God Bless you along with all the devoted Catholics who frequent this bastion of true Catholicism. I’m certain this is just the tip of the iceberg and I will be adding to my rosaries for grace for the suffering to come.
    .

  4. The reason we’re all scratching our heads about the reason(s) for this apparently precipitous action is that the letter from the Bishop does not itemize the facts underpinning the sanction. Where I’m from, the charges are identified in writing so that one may defend against them.

  5. And the witch hunt continues. It is going to get much worse I fear. We may well become like the Church in China, underground and hidden. Or like St. Athanasius in the desert.

  7. Funny thing, the scales fell from my eyes in 1985 when then Cardinal Raztinger made some very direct, simple and truthful observations in the Ratzinger Report. It was there, or somewhere else, where he said not every valid council was good for the Church. The entire point of the hermeneutic of continuity was an implicit rejection of the entire VII apparatus,hook, line and sinker. Ratzinger’s youthful involvment when these things were happening gave him unparalleled credibility. It, along with a gentle temperament, might have prevented him from moving more decisively as Pope Benedict and resulted in him being devoured by the wolves. But you are right on the money when you call out NewChurch in this regard (a term I used to dislike but which now I think is necessary)

  8. This has absolutely nothing to do with the right of access to the traditional liturgy.

    If it is known, and not merely rumored, that the Bishop requires Mr. King to either affirm or reject certain specific propositions on pain of heresy let him do so to the better instruction of us all.

  9. This has absolutely nothing to do with the right of access to the traditional liturgy.

    If it is known, and not merely rumored, that the Bishop requires Mr. King to either affirm or reject certain specific propositions on pain of heresy let him do so to the better instruction of us all.

  10. The “church” leaders will betray the faithful followers of Jesus Christ just as Jesus was betrayed…its the Passion of the Church.

    It is going to get much worse…God Help Us!

  12. Publius, search the net for this essay:

    The Oath Against Modernism vs. the “Hermeneutic of Continuity,” by John Vennari

    The “reform of the reform” and the “hermeneutic of continuity” are, in fact, very much part of the wreckage of the Judas Council.

  14. Chronic Sinner…….I have just posted for you some information regarding Fr. Gruner……..but, for some strange reason, my comment is awaiting moderation………’strange’.

  15. Publius

    Please enlighten me on Mr Ratzinger. You are claiming, that despite the fact that he was one of the driving forces in destroying the Church at the vat 2 council, he came to his senses about 20 years later; and then about 30 years after that, after being elected pope and being of full understanding of the EVIL he taken part in, he was not able to denounce the council of satan (vat2) because of outside pressure? If I am reading your comment in error please correct me. If I am reading it right, I cannot believe that Mr. Ratzinger can ever be exonerated until he comes clean. Lots of people, even people who call themselves Traditional Catholics, are willing to give these men the benefit of the doubt because they were elected pope. I say nuts to that nonsense. These men as popes have done more harm to the Church than anyone else. Why we continue to make excuse for them because they are the “holy father” is simply mind boggling….they should be defamed just like any other heretic.

  16. Yes, better come down real hard on those Vatican II dissenters but when it comes to pedophile or homosexual Priests nothing need be done. Cover-up is their answer. There are no rules they follow it’s only rules that those who are faithful must follow and they are their rules.

  19. Nell

    Most of the “leaders” of our Church are only in the Church to begin with because they were recruited into it for disgusting purposes. Google the name Bella Dodd….she was a leader of the American Communist Party back in the 30’s who later became a Catholic. See what she had to say, about what was happening to our Church back in the 20’s and 30’s and where it was headed in the future (and she spoke about this in the 50’s). It is truly an eye-opener….but it makes what we have seen going on for the last 50+ years make a lot of sense. The vat 2 church CANNOT become good…it is an impossibility. There will never again be a good pope….it cannot happen. Anyone who thinks things will get better before Christ Himself rectifies all is mistaken.

  23. Andrew said: “And in other news, the pope accidentally dropped the F word during the Sunday Angelus”.
    Unless it was mistranslated in the process, I can honestly say that we are in the midst of a “Coprophagian Papacy”.

  25. Francis dropped an F-Bomb? Oh, dear, I can hear the ecclesiasticalporncops lockstepping into action as we speak – not to beat Francis over the head with a baton – but anyone who doesn’t pretend they don’t know. it’s like one of those old movies where one guy keeps hitting the other guy when he feels frustrated or confused.
    –
    @Rich, I think Publius might be suggesting that Benedict grew out of the rage of the age, and grew up and actually did something crucially important for the Church, much of which Francis and Olsen and the charge of the blight brigade are trying to f-bomb into oblivion.
    –
    Churchill once said, ‘if you’re not a rebel at 20 you have no heart, if you’re still a rebel at 40, you have no brains.’

  26. p.s. and yet the revolution rolls on into their 60s and 70s and then rolls back into 40 something bishops – where are all their brains? Oh, of course, being carefully and quietly robbed in the tent by the son’s of cover-up, make-up, and ‘nothing to see here, moooooove right along, nothing to see here.’ And you better move along because they’ll poke out your eye if the see the truth in it’s reflection.

  27. s.armaticus: apparently it was a common spanish slip of the tongue on a common word and a common cuss. But then after coprophagia, it’s all within bounds, really, slip of the tongue or not.

  28. Lou,

    The Modernists, once in power, have always first attacked the formation programs of Catholics. It had nothing to do with Fr. Gruner, it had everything to do with the $300,000 successful fundraising campaign….

    I’d bet the Bishop asked the President for some of that, and when refused, threatened institutional excommunication….

    Olson is not going to repent, that would require the FAith…

  31. thanks for the link, Catholic Militant. Fr. Rodriguez talk is like a concise encyclopeadia of where the Church was, where She is, and what to do.

  32. p.s. you can also find these talks at Fr.s site Louie’s blog roll if the audio download plays up.

  33. Let me get this straight – invite a pro-abort, pro-sodomy, pro-SSM speaker to give your commencement speech (Georgetown, Notre Shame, Xavier, Marquette, and any other number of “Catholic” colleges) and the Bishop says . . . . . (crickets). But a small-time college has an allegedly suspended priest speak or do something, and suddenly the Bishop comes down on the school like a ton of bricks? Even if everything opponents of F-M say is true about F-M and then some, there sure is a disparity in treatment to say the least.

  34. Saluto:

    LOL, the Churchill quote. I am hoping that holds true for my 19 year old.

    And thanks for trying to make me more comprehensible.

    Rich:

    Could it be that the Catholic virtue of obedience and the concern for unity became unhealthy resulting in mass apostasy in our midst?

    In Ratzinger’s case, he seemed to recognize the disaster early on- retiring to Regensberg from Tubingen in 1967. The Communio group was formed in reaction to the wreckers. I say this gave them credibility when the retrenched because they had tried, indeed, been leaders of the movement. Remember, even Lefebre signed the documents of VII.

    Why did B XVI not move more decisively? Partly it seems a failure of nerve, a failure of charachter, a mistaken understanding of what authority requires. Perhaps a naive hope that the true faith and true worship would win out over the false.

    But it is always important to make distinctions. And B XVI has shown such integrity and bravery compared to the rest. The very first thing that BXVI did was to suspend Fr. Maciel. How this must have stirred forces to fury.

    Anyway, we have the canonization of JPII upon us and who knows what in October. We will need deft hermeneutic now for the promise that the gates of Hell would not prevail against his church. I always avoided the private revelation mill (from LaSalette to Lordes, to Fatima, Garabandal, etc). It seemed to me that I needed to focus on the dogmatic teachings of the Church which are inexhaustible in their depth. I found them terribly distracting. Now it seems that they may have been made because somehow the great apostasy had to happen- just as Our Lord suffered in the flesh, so His Church is now in agony.

    Anyway, cheers and a happy and indulgent Mardi Gras to you and all.

    Yours,

    Publius

  35. @Halina…thanks for the links on Fr. Gruner, From what I have seen, the “suspension” charge is completely bogus. I have read and watched Fr. Gruner’s material on Fatima, the TLM, tradition in general, sin and redemption, the SSPX, etc., and he comes across as knowlegeable, humble, and devoted to the Church and the Blessed Mother. If that gets you “suspended” then so be it. Pax Tecum, Halina and thanks again.

  36. @ChronicSinner,

    Sir Thomas More: “I do none harm, I say none harm, I think none harm. And if this be not enough to keep a man alive, in good faith I long not to live.” – A Man for All Seasons –

  37. Hi Louie,

    Maybe for your next video you can be an Elvis impersonator and give us your version of “You can do anything, but lay off of my Vatican II”. Anyone want to take a shot at some verses…

    “You can murder babies,
    Have gay masses,
    ….
    But don’t you, step on my Vatican II.
    You can do anything, but lay off of my Vatican II!”

    (To the tune of Blue Suede Shoes)

  40. @publius: I LOL first time I heard that quote too.
    @s.armaticus: the enough rope to hang oneself modernist liberty seems to be doing just that.
    @Michael Leon: vati-two-bluesuede shoes. heheh.

  41. SArmaticus: Why is that interesting? Archbishop Sample has been offering the TLM since he was first ordained a priest. He is one of several bishops who do so regularly.

  42. Fr Gruner was Incardinated under an Indian Archbishop, so the whole Suspension Nonsense, an Act of Cardinal Sodano, because the Actual Consecration to Our Lady, by Pope John Paul II was not made specifically for Russia, was Moot.

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