According to Vatican News Service, a common declaration has been issued bearing the signatures of both “HIS GRACE JUSTIN WELBY” and “HIS HOLINESS FRANCIS” proposing to send “out on mission together 19 pairs of Anglican and Catholic bishops from countries around the world.”
The document is precisely what one might expect in this post-conciliar age of radical ecumenism; namely, a grave offense against Christ and an embarrassment to the faithful.
It’s more than that, though; it’s yet another indication of the faith, or lack thereof, of its signatories.
The text refers, not only to the heretic layman Justin Welby before whom “His Holiness Francis” scandalously bowed his head for a blessing during at least one of his visits to Rome, but also to an assortment of various other heretic laymen as “Archbishop,” in total, more than half-a-dozen times.
The declaration proposes to “commission” nineteen other fake bishops of the Anglican kind along with an equal number of Catholic bishops “to send them forth in pairs as the Lord sent out the seventy-two disciples.”
Seriously?
I was unaware that among the seventy-two sent forth by Our Lord were men and women who reject such fundamental truths of the Faith as that concerning the Most Holy Eucharist, the priesthood, Holy Mass, the Blessed Virgin Mary and yet embrace homosexual activity, contraception and even abortion.
When Our Lord sent out the seventy-two, He said, “Behold I send you as lambs among wolves.” (Luke 10:3)
Francis, by contrast, is sending forth wolves among the lambs!
The word “Apostle” means “one who is sent forth;” either directly by Christ or by His Church.
Here we have Francis sending forth a collection of nineteen heretic laymen and women pretending to be bishops “to give voice to our common faith in the Lord Jesus Christ;” as if they have some legitimate claim to Apostolic succession.
Those who hold and profess the Catholic faith know better.
Pope Leo XIII definitively removed any and all doubt in this matter:
Wherefore, strictly adhering, in this matter, to the decrees of the pontiffs, our predecessors, and confirming them most fully, and, as it were, renewing them by our authority, of our own initiative and certain knowledge, we pronounce and declare that ordinations carried out according to the Anglican rite have been, and are, absolutely null and utterly void. (Apostolicae Curae 36)
At any time prior to the Age of Fruitless Dialogue inaugurated at Vatican Council II, no cleric (much less a pope) would have addressed costumed heretic laymen and women as “bishop” much less deign to send them out on a joint mission “to be Christ’s witnesses” along with actual (albeit pathetic in their own right) bishops, as if to imply that the former enjoys legitimate Apostolic succession.
Big deal, he’s done much worse!
Indeed, but there can be no doubt that this preposterous declaration is enough to lead a sincere soul in search of the true faith to believe that one does just as well to take up membership in a Lutheran community, perhaps even under the leadership of a lesbian “bishop,” as in the one Church of Christ.
Again, those who hold and profess the Catholic faith know better, but the terrible question that one is forced to ask is simply this:
Does Francis believe as Catholics believe?
With every passing day this question becomes more urgent, but let’s be clear:
Ours is not to judge the interior disposition of Jorge Bergoglio’s soul. That’s Our Lord’s job.
That said, making observations based on objective reality is entirely appropriate; indeed, given the degree to which so many are confused in our day, it is entirely necessary!
One can scarcely deny that there is precious little evidence that “His Holiness Francis” actually holds the Catholic faith; not just on the matter of Anglican ordinations, but on a whole host of others – including such fundamentally important matters as marriage, mortal sin, the Blessedness of Our Lady, the Real Presence of Christ in the Most Holy Eucharist, and on and on the list could go.
By contrast, there is an overwhelming amount of evidence – namely, his own well-documented words and deeds – that indicate, and very strongly so, that Francis holds to some highly personalized version of Protestantism that may more properly be understood as a form of secular humanism.
The entire purpose of this “joint commissioning” with the heretics is stated in the declaration:
“The world must see us witnessing to this common faith in Jesus by acting together. We can, and must, work together to protect and preserve our common home: living, teaching and acting in ways that favour a speedy end to the environmental destruction that offends the Creator and degrades his creatures, and building individual and collective patterns of behaviour that foster a sustainable and integral development for the good of all.”
Remove the flowery pseudo-Christian prose from this screed and it’s really nothing more glorious than a call to environmental activism worthy of the U.N.
For Francis, if it takes blurring the lines between the one true Church of Jesus Christ and a gathering of heretics posing as clerics to get on with the task of “sustainable development,” so be it.
Now you tell me, are these the priorities of a Catholic?
Truly, we live in a day when the man considered by most of the world to be the Vicar of Christ on earth shows forth every appearance of being, at best, a lukewarm Protestant; at worst, a dyed-in-the-wool humanist.
The situation couldn’t be more serious.
We must pray for Francis – quite literally, for his conversion, that he might come to embrace, teach, and defend the Catholic faith in its fullness. His soul, as well as that of countless others is at stake.
We must also pray for those in the sacred hierarchy who recognize the seriousness of this situation and yet are paralyzed – whether by fear, or careerism, or whatever the case may be – that they may be granted the grace to speak up loudly and clearly in defense of the flock, for truly, wolves in clerical clothing now roam freely among the lambs.
“By their fruits you shall know them. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit, and the evil tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can an evil tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit, shall be cut down, and shall be cast into the fire.
Wherefore by their fruits you shall know them.” – Matthew 7: 16-20 –
“That which thou dost, do quickly.”
It’s too bad the comedian Joey Bishop died in 2007. Although Jewish, he could have been a great addition to this ecumenical gaggle of “bishops.”
Lord, have mercy on us! Reparation! Please free us from this evil man and all those ravening wolves who are bishops, cardinals, etc. save us and our loved ones and all those in danger from these wicked men! How much longer?? How much more?? They’re leading countless soyls away from God and the One True Faith and salvation.
It is the false prophet and the NWO one world false, tyrannic “religion” of Satan.
Dear God forgive us! Help us to properly repent and make reparation.
“Seven years before the last day, the sea shall submerge Eire in one inundation.” – St. Columcille/Columba (521-597)
Let’s see Irish Water try to charge us for that one, Lynda.
Prayer and reparation to be sure. Hang on to those wellies.
One may conclude that Fr. Bergoglio has been brainwashed by Freemasonry and is auditioning for the roll of leader of “One World Church of the New World Order” in complete alignment with Our Blessed Mother’s warning of Diabolical Disorientation.
God love you, my neighbors.
This man is not the pope.
It’s either that or this blog site is controlled opposition. Just as theremnant is.
You know, folks, long before I ever heard the name Jorge Bergoglio, I was being shunned for suggesting anything concerning evangelization – by my fellow Catholics!
The anti-proselytism thing was already being expressed in the new do-goodism *faith*. And NOBODY, even the most faithful in the Church, wants to hear anything about the Truth God’s Church has always proclaimed. It seems everybody just wants to feel good.
I am a firm believer that our worst, most vehement persecutors will be those who call themselves “Catholic” but do not hold the Faith.
I respect and greatly admire you, Mr. Verrecchio, for the courageous stand you take. I’m sure it costs you bigtime in this life, but we know you’ll be well rewarded for it in the next. God bless you and your loved ones, as I’m sure it costs them as well.
You are correct. Just like the Jews did to their brothers, the early Christians: It was the family and friends of the Christians who persecuted them.
And the same thing will happen to True Catholics today. They will be turned into the powers-at-be by their own fellow “Catholics”…
“On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being locked where the disciples were for fear of the Jews…”
I would bet that Benedict XVI is still the Pope whether he likes it or not.
Ah, but so many keep telling us he really is the Pope. “Only formal heresy,” “only formal action by the hierarchy” and all that, you know. But I’m anxious to see what Voris et al will have to say about Jorge Bergoglio on Nov. 1 after he has expressed his appreciation to Martin Luther for that heretic’s efforts at what Bergoglio sees as the need for ongoing “renewal” of the “church” and his apology for all the evil things the Church has done to heretics in the last 500 years. It would seem that in the very near future Jorge and most of his cardinals and bishops should be contacting Bishop Fellay expressing their desire to once again be in full communion with the real Church. All they do now is occupy traditionally Catholic real estate.
JB isn’t promoting his own agenda. The Jesuits are pulling the strings. The Jesuits are one of the prime movers of the NWO.
This little piece of commentary seems to fit our times and our situation:
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Commentary on the Apocalypse (Victorinus)
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“…The sixth class is the mode of life of the best election. The habit of saints is set forth; of those, to wit, who are lowly in the world, and unskilled in the Scriptures, and who hold the faith immoveably, and are not at all broken down by any chance, or withdrawn from the faith by any fear. Therefore He says to them:—
‘I have set before you an open door, because you have kept the word of my patience. In such little strength.’
‘ And I will keep you from the hour of temptation.’
That they may know His glory to be of this kind, that they are not indeed permitted to be given over to temptation.
‘He that overcomes shall be made a pillar in the temple of God. ‘
For even as a pillar is an ornament of the building, so he who perseveres shall obtain a nobility in the Church.
Moreover, the seventh association of the Church declares that they are rich men placed in positions of dignity, but believing that they are rich, among whom indeed the Scriptures are discussed in their bedchamber, while the faithful are outside; and they are understood by none, although they boast themselves, and say that they know all things—endowed with the confidence of learning, but ceasing from its labour. And thus He says:—
‘That they are neither cold nor hot.’
That is, neither unbelieving nor believing, for they are all things to all men. And because he who is neither cold nor hot, but lukewarm, gives nausea, He says:—
‘I will vomit you out of My mouth.’
Although nausea is hateful, still it hurts no one; so also is it with men of this kind when they have been cast forth. But because there is time of repentance, He says:—
‘I persuade you to buy of Me gold tried in the fire. ‘
That is, that in whatever manner you can, you should suffer for the Lord’s name tribulations and passions.
‘And anoint your eyes with eye-salve. ‘
That what you gladly know by the Scripture, you should strive also to do the work of the same. And because, if in these ways men return out of great destruction to great repentance, they are not only useful to themselves, but they are able also to be of advantage to many, He promised them no small reward—to sit, namely, on the throne of judgment. …”
Its time to face an ugly truth. There may be no true Pope at this time. I keep going over this over and over again trying to make sense of the state of the church today. It is not the church of my youth, it is not the faith handed down to me by my parents and grandparents. And it is certainly not the faith I am passing on to my children. I am tired of hearing all sorts of convoluted twisted logic to justify the antics and pronouncments coming from the hierarchy.
2 Peter 2:1-3
False Prophets and Their Punishment
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2 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their licentiousness, and because of them the way of truth will be reviled. 3 And in their greed they will exploit you with false words; from of old their condemnation has not been idle, and their destruction has not been asleep
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Deuteronomy 22:10
Thou shalt not plough with an ox and an ass together
2 Corinthians 6:14
Bear not the yoke with unbelievers. For what participation hath justice with injustice? Or what fellowship hath light with darkness?
Proverbs 18:2-7
A fool takes no pleasure in understanding but only in expressing his opinion. When wickedness comes, contempt comes also; and with dishonor comes disgrace. The words of a man’s mouth are deep waters, the fountain of wisdom is a gushing stream. It is not good to be partial to a wicked man, or deprive a righteous man of justice. A fool’s lips bring strife, and his mouth invites a flogging. A fool’s mouth is his ruin, and his lips a snare to himself.
Proverbs 9:7 -10
He who corrects a scoffer gets himself abuse, and he who reproves a wicked man incurs injury. Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you; reprove a wise man, and he will love you. Give instruction to a wise man, and he will still be wiser; teach a righteous man and he will increase in learning. The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom, and the knowledge of the Holy One is insight.
Matthew 7:6 Do not give to dogs what is holy; and do not throw your pearls before swine, lest they trample them underfoot and turn to attack you.
– Didache – The Teaching of the 12 Apostles
16:3 For in the last days false prophets and seducers shall be multiplied, and the sheep shall be turned into wolves, and love shall be turned into hate;
16:4 and because iniquity aboundeth they shall hate each other, and persecute each other, and deliver each other up; and then shall the Deceiver of the world appear as the Son of God, and shall do signs and wonders, and the earth shall be delivered into his hands; and he shall do unlawful things, such as have never happened since the beginning of the world.
16:5 Then shall the creation of man come to the fiery trial of proof, and many shall be offended and shall perish; but they who remain in their faith shall be saved by the rock of offence itself.
There is a Pope. A Pope was elected by the Cardinals. The Monks in a Monastery elect their Abbot. Same thing. People in the USA vote and a President is elected. Same thing. The real Pope may still be Benedict XVI, but that’s the only question.
Why you knuckleheads think being elected Pope somehow makes a man perfect is real insanity. The ugly truth is, Tom, that you and others like you are whacked. Do you want to be a Catholic, Tom? Then you have to admit that there is a Pope.
Goofballs believe that there is such a thing as a Bigfoot, but nobody ever caught one. There is a Pope, but jokers like you say that there is no Pope. What is the difference between Bigfoot lovers and Pope deniers? I don’t see a difference, Tom.
Peace and blessings Tom – the lawyers like Mr Salza are fond of telling us that we cannot declare the Pope a heretic, and while legally they might be correct, in our hearts we know that he is a heretic and therefore cannot be obeyed. I have said before he is not my Pope, so I personally do not have a Pope in Rome, but I do have hundreds of Popes from the past who’s authority still holds. Keep the faith brother and pass it on, and ignore the fools in the hierarchy – they will have their reward
Yes we have a Pope in name and election ,be that election free or manipulated , but surely not a true Vicar of Christ judging from what he says and does.
I am in full agreement with you, bamacnz. Even if Francis is the true pope, he is not, by any stretch of the imagination, the Vicar of Christ. IMO, he is totally useless. Does that make me a bad Catholic?
If the Pope teaches heresy, a Catholic will not accept the heresy. But here’s the thing, if God wanted to use this same Pope to define an infallible dogma tomorrow, God could do it. That’s why there is a Pope.
Our Lord promised to be with His Church, “all days, even to the consummation of the world”. Our Lord is with His Church through His Vicar on Earth, the Pope. If you say there is no Pope, you call Jesus Christ a liar.
No.., you are an “observant” Catholic.
Such ad homenin attacks upon me. I was taught that when in a debate or a discussion, the first side that resorts to ad homenin insults has already lost. If you read carefully, you will notice that I used the word “may” very carefully for at this time I have doubt. I ask rushintuit to please read Pope Paul IV Ex Cum Apostolatus. And thank you for calling me “whacked”, “knucklehead”, and a “joker.” This is exactly what the Modernists and communists do to silence their opponents.
Objectively speaking, a Pope cannot teach heresy. The church is infaillable and indefectable. Yet every day we hear blasphemous and heretical statements and see blasphemous and heretical actions coming from Rome and our Bishops. So either Jesus lied or these men are not who we believe them to be. Logic is leading me down a road I rather not go. I ask please for any reader to show me the error in this logic. I am not try to defend a position, I am trying to discern the truth and name calling helps no one. We are all confused Catholics abandoned by our shepards.
I would like to add that among the “useless” are the hierarchy, clergy and laity who either do not observe because they don’t care enough and those who do observe and don’t have the courage to speak out. Personally, I want nothing to do with this traitorous pseudo-“church”. It is easier to be (aka) Catholic when you know the enemy. Thanks, mpoulin.
“Objectively speaking, a Pope cannot teach heresy. The church is infaillable and indefectable.
You went from Pope to Church, which are two different issues. Vatican Council I defined the specific conditions for Papal Infallibility. And when the Pope is not speaking infallibly, the Pope is speaking fallibly. You’re right about the Church, but wrong about the Pope.
This place is a hangout for Sedevacantists for some reason. You “may” be leaning toward their position. Straighten up and you won’t get called the names Sedevacantists deserve to be called.
It makes you irrational at the very least. Pope and Vicar of Christ are one and the same Office. Some of you people that post these comments here are way out there in la la land.
Again, name calling and labelling as opposed to logical debate. Please tell me by what arguement and facts have you come to oppose the sedevacantist position other than name calling. I have read many of the articles that the SSPX has put out and they seem to make legal sense, yet I am not a canon lawyer. I have also examined the sedevacantists positions and find it very logical yet very hard to accept on an emotional level. it overturns all we have been led to believe since Vatican II.
Pope and Vicar of Christ are one in the same office. Therefore, behavior means nothing. How’s the weather these days in la la land?
Sedevacantism is not a logical position. It calls for a private, individual judgement about who is and who is not a Pope. The Cardinals elect the Pope and only they or a Council can depose a Pope.
The way a Pope behaves matters a great deal as to the salvation of his soul and the innumerable souls Our Lord has given to his care. What means nothing, is a private judgement by a Sedevacantist, declaring this or that Pope to be true or anti. Only the Cardinals who elected the Pope, or a Church Council, can depose a Pope.
A pope cannot teach error. Be it through infallible pronouncements (which only appear every 150 years or so) or through UOM universal ordinary magisterium, (Encyclical,s public pronouncement regarding the faith, documents etc) which also is BINDING.
Rushintoit, do not think the pope is only binding when speakign ex-Cathedra.
This imposter, is not the pope.
Don’t look now, but your ignorance is showing.
You declared a pope is only binding when speaking Ex-cathedra. Not true. Do your homework on UOM (universal ordinary magisterium).
Then talk to us about binding to Catholics.
Sigh…
False dichotomy.
The Church has had times when the see has been vacant.
Between when a pope dies and a new one is elected is an example.
Crisis in the past for 3,4,5 years without a pope. etc. This is not a new situation. Just a longer one.
You also say a pope can “teach” heresy today but can speak infallibly tomorrow. With that, you just discredited yourself from serious discussion regarding this topic. I invite you to read and study more about the Catholic faith. Those pronouncements you are making are not Catholic.
“Straighten up and you won’t get called the names Sedevacantists deserve to be called.”-Rushintoit
You mean Catholic.
You should change your moniker to SHUSHintoit
Dear Brother in Christ, Anyone who lives his Catholic Faith is being persecuted, and the better you live the Faith, the more persecuted you are. And most of the bishops, priests, etc. aid and comfort our persecutors. Catholics need the support of each other and the few good priests. God bless you.
Dear Tom, You are not going mad. You are a true Catholic living among apostates that hate us because we love and obey God and will not cooperate with their evil (including those from the top down in the institutions of the Church). Our Faith and reason tell us Francis is most likely a formal heretic, not a Catholic. However, he continues to hold the external office of the papacy until certain procedures have been fulfilled. I suggest that for one, you read Siscoe’s and Salza’s book, “True or False Pope?” God bless you. Ignore the ad hominem attacks. Your sister in Christ, Lynda
Yes, dear, Bosco! Trying to hang on. God bless you! Your sister in Christ, Lynda
“A Pope cannot teach error.” -GMU
That is the dumbest thing I have ever read anywhere. Yes, there is an Ordinary and Extra-Ordinary Magisterium. But what keeps a Pope from using either one and instead, teach error? NOTHING, if that is what he chooses to do.
GMU, you are mentally challenged on this.
Archbishop Lefebvre:
“We refuse, on the other hand, and have always refused to follow the Rome of neo-Modernist and neo-Protestant tendencies which were clearly evident in the Second Vatican Council and, after the Council, in all the reforms which issued from it.
All these reforms, indeed, have contributed and are still contributing to the destruction of the Church, to the ruin of the priesthood, to the abolition of the Sacrifice of the Mass and of the sacraments, to the disappearance of religious life, to a naturalist and Teilhardian teaching in universities, seminaries and catechectics; a teaching derived from Liberalism and Protestantism, many times condemned by the solemn Magisterium of the Church.
No authority, not even the highest in the hierarchy, can force us to abandon or diminish our Catholic faith, so clearly expressed and professed by the Church’s Magisterium for nineteen centuries.
“But though we,” says St. Paul, “or an angel from heaven preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema” (Gal. 1:8).”
+Lefebvre:
“We are not “free” in religious matters any more than we are free in moral questions; we do not have the right to follow whatever morality our conscience suggests; we do not have the right to follow whatever kind of faith conforms to our temperament and way of thinking. Faith and morals are imposed upon us by God, and Our Lord Jesus Christ is God. It is thus inadmissible to give the impression that all religions are equally good, that all moral teachings are equal.”
GMU, you are a mentally challenged person. Go back and read my previous answer. I said there are three ways a Pope can speak:
1) Ordinary Magisterium
2) Extra-Ordinary Magisterium
3) Fallible Human Being
Can you please cite an authoritative source as to how Cardinals or Councils can depose a Pope. As I understand it the Pope answers only to God. No power on earth can judge him. This is why it is the teaching of the church that a heretic simply loses his office. Please read Paul IV Ex Cum Apostolatus.
Thank you Lynda. I will look up the book. I am beginning to think that it really doesnt matter whether there is a pope right now. As long as the church as we used to know it is occupied by modernists, we trads owe no alliegence to it or the impostors who rule it. I just wish all trads could stop squabbling and carry on teaching the true Catholic faith. Perhaps one day enough traditional bishops will figure out that modernist rome is never going to change and that it is time to forget about them and elect a true Pope.
The Remnant Newspaper has a good article on the topic.
Google, “can the church depose an heretical pope”.
You still don’t understand. A council can declare a pope invalid. (AFTER THE FACT). But a heretical “pope” deposes himself ipso facto.
So GMU is smarter than Bishop Fellay and all of the SSPX?
As GMU states succinctly, a heretic pope declares himself a heretic through his heresy and is therefore no longer Catholic, and obviously no longer a pope….no “personal judgement (whatever that is) necessary. No “council of cardinals” has the authority to put a valid pope “on trial” for heresy. This idea is utter stupidity and I truly hope that sincere Catholics stop promoting this BS idea.
Tom A
There is no valid citation stating that a valid pope can be deposed by anyone because this is a Catholic impossibility. Anyone who suggests to you that this can possibly happen is not of the Church. A valid pope has no earthly peers….he CANNOT be put on trial for heresy.
Well said Rich. No novelty in your words.
The anti-catholic idea which Rushintoit espouses is what has been recently introduced by the new-church. Controlled opposition it were: Just enough leeway for the “trads” to huff an puff, but using a Vat-2 chain in order to cut off Catholic reasoning.
Make no mistake: This is controlled opposition.
10. So, Venerable Brethren, it is clear why this Apostolic See has never allowed its subjects to take part in the assemblies of non-Catholics: for the union of Christians can only be promoted by promoting the return to the one true Church of Christ of those who are separated from it, for in the past they have unhappily left it. To the one true Church of Christ, we say, which is visible to all, and which is to remain, according to the will of its Author, exactly the same as He instituted it. During the lapse of centuries, the mystical Spouse of Christ has never been contaminated, nor can she ever in the future be contaminated, as Cyprian bears witness: “The Bride of Christ cannot be made false to her Spouse: she is incorrupt and modest. She knows but one dwelling, she guards the sanctity of the nuptial chamber chastely and modestly.” The same holy Martyr with good reason marveled exceedingly that anyone could believe that “this unity in the Church which arises from a divine foundation, and which is knit together by heavenly sacraments, could be rent and torn asunder by the force of contrary wills.” For since the mystical body of Christ, in the same manner as His physical body, is one, compacted and fitly joined together, it were foolish and out of place to say that the mystical body is made up of members which are disunited and scattered abroad: whosoever therefore is not united with the body is no member of it, neither is he in communion with Christ its head.
MORTALIUM ANIMOS (On Religious Unity) Pope Pius XI 6 January 1928
He is not auditioning. He already has the job.
Ach! Discovered. God bless you, Lynda.
rich, I ask this question in all sincerity: Whether Bergoglio is a true pope or a false pope, he is, for all intents and purposes, “the Pope” because that is how the world-at-large sees him. Therefore, what would be, in your opinion, the best and most appropriate solution to stopping Bergoglio before more souls are sent to hell because of his betrayal of Christ? If, as you say, “no council of cardinals has the authority to put a valid pope on trail for heresy”, what would be the alternative to stopping this man before more damage is done. This is not a rhetorical question or a “trick” question. I am asking you because I agree with much of your comments and your love for the Catholic faith is very evident. Could Bergoglio be ex-communicated without a trial?
My2cents, that ship has sailed a long time ago. (He has ex-communicated himself ipso-facto). Just as a “catholic” pro-abort excommunicates himself on the spot. So does a heretical “pope”.
Pray, fast and be steadfast in the faith, with a real priest. Stay away from V2 “teachings” and novelties. God is in control. This “pope” and company are leading blind sheep into Hell. Stay away from them. They are in a false church. We are in the one True Church.
St. Athanasius quite aptly said in the Arian crisis:
“May God console you! … What saddens you … is the fact that others have occupied the churches by violence, while during this time you are on the outside. It is a fact that they have the premises – but you have the Apostolic Faith. They can occupy our churches, but they are outside the true Faith. You remain outside the places of worship, but the Faith dwells within you. Let us consider: what is more important, the place or the Faith? The true Faith, obviously. Who has lost and who has won in the struggle – the one who keeps the premises or the one who keeps the Faith? True, the premises are good when the Apostolic Faith is preached there; they are holy if everything takes place there in a holy way …
“You are the ones who are happy; you who remain within the Church by your Faith, who hold firmly to the foundations of the Faith which has come down to you from Apostolic Tradition. And if an execrable jealousy has tried to shake it on a number of occasions, it has not succeeded. They are the ones who have broken away from it in the present crisis. No one, ever, will prevail against your Faith, beloved Brothers. And we believe that God will give us our churches back some day.
“Thus, the more violently they try to occupy the places of worship, the more they separate themselves from the Church. They claim that they represent the Church; but in reality, they are the ones who are expelling themselves from it and going astray. Even if Catholics faithful to Tradition are reduced to a handful, they are the ones who are the true Church of Jesus Christ.”
Likewise we ought to read simple and devout books as willingly as learned and profound ones. We ought not to be swayed by the authority of the writer, whether he be a great literary light or an insignificant person, but by the love of simple truth. We ought not to ask who is speaking, but mark what is said. Men pass away, but the truth of the Lord remains forever. God speaks to us in many ways without regard for persons.
Imitation of Christ
Book one; chapter five
Thomas a Kempis
My2Cents…thank you for your kind words. GMU’s response to your questions is basically exactly how I would have responded. As GMU points out, any heretic (jorge in this case) is ex-communicated, latae sententiae, as soon as they commit to said heresy. In addition to what GMU has said I would just add that we all need to keep reading and keep learning.
As the great St. John Vianney (the cure d’Ars) once said (and Im paraphrasing here), most Catholics will go to Hell, and the reason will be because they never learned their Faith.
Thanks. I guess craziness (the vatican 2 false faith) leads to more craziness (the ridiculous notion that cardinals could put the vicar of Christ Himself on trial for heresy….wow).
The Pope is elected and remains the Pope until he dies, resigns, or is deposed for teaching heresy. Any ordinary Catholic that rejects one dogma, rejects all dogmas and ceases to be a Catholic. The same thing is true for any member of the Clergy, no matter his rank.
While a Pope that teaches heresy ceases to be a Catholic, he continues to be the Pope. This fact should be obvious to anyone who turns on the news and sees Pope Francis, Googles the word Pope or Catholic Church, etc. Sedevacantists make a private judgement that Pope Francis, Benedict XVI, JPII, JPI, Paul VI, John XXIII, are not the Pope because they say so.
Sedevacantism is illogical and irrational. The entire world knows who the Pope is, except the Sedes. They fool themselves every minute of every day. They are not Catholics.
Catholicism is not a democracy Sushintoit.
Because 1.1billion people think a heretic to be a pope does not make him one.
Because Google or the news say a heretic is a pope should not lead you into believing so.
You even admitted in a previous post saying “Francis is not the pope, but Benedict, whether he knows it or not is the pope.” See? Even you don’t know who the pope is.
So stop with the Catholic-bashing, Novus-Ordo rhetoric.
It is very hypocritical.
You are in our prayers.
Nonsense. One who is not a member of our Church obviously cannot be the leader of our Church (because in order to be a pope you HAVE to be a Catholic). Your premise allows for the possibility that a TRUE vicar of Christ Himself is allowed by the Lord to lead souls to hell. This idea is both disgusting and total hogwash.
Excellent quote, truly. Too bad that the master of false ecumenism, jorge, would spit on these words just as he, a totally EVIL human being, spits on Catholicism every day.
Thank you, rich and GMU for your responses. I understand what you are saying. However, I admit I would love to see a PUBLIC excommunication of this egomaniac. I think this would demonstrate to the Catholic world that Bergoglio has been leading them astray. Also, I would love the PUBLIC humiliation of Bergoglio & Co. and those who stood by mute and idle during this tragic papacy. In the end, our salvation (or lack of) is our own doing. Stay away from this mess in pseudo-“church”, adhere to Tradition, and stay close to OUR LADY!!! Thank you, again.
You didnt read Cum Ex Apostolatus did you? It says that the heretic loses his office and authority and in addition all subsequent appointments and decrees are invalid. His soul is eternally marked by his priesthood or episcopacy, but he loses all temporal powers.
Sure you told us years ago on one of the Catholic sites we would comment on – perhaps Laurence England’s. God bless you. Lynda
That is the truth. And a man whose reason or good will has not been corrupted abides by this.
I agree with you….but our cast of (clowns) cardinals are just as bad, if not worse, then the humble Argentinian is.
No earthly body could ever publicly ex-communicate a pope until said pope, through his heresy, ex-communicated himself; and even then they would not be ex-communicating him, but would rather be formally stating that he ex-communicated himself.
I feel it really does not matter with respect to our own eternal life whether Francis is Pope or not, validly elected or not, heretic or not. I think the real question we should be asking is: Does he teach the Truth? Does his teaching match that of previous Popes? I am absolutely sure the answer to both questions is an emphatic “no”! and so I am justified in both ignoring him and opposing him. Truth overrules everything.
Yes Rich, I realize that not Scripture nor Tradition nor Church Fathers nor previous Popes nor (pre VII) Councils are worth half a penny to the Modernist. You and I can quote the former until our hands bloody our keyboards and it simply will not matter to the evil clown heretic. This problem will not be solved by human means.
Michael F Poulin
And non sedevacantists make a private judgment that a pope is pope because they say so. That logic cuts both ways. It is not anyones private judgment that makes one a pope.
Whether a Pope loses his Office, ipso facto, or jure divino, he must still be judged first by the Church. Even Father Cekada wrote, “defection from the faith is the one sin of a pope we are permitted to judge”. I encourage you to Google, “Answering a Sedevacantist Critic”.
Fr Cekada never said that a valid pope can be put on trial for heresy. You are now willfully twisting the words of a good man/priest. Shame on you for that.
All of this dissension among “trads” is playing right into the Devil’s hand. How does he succeed but through division? The truth is we as individuals can do nothing to stop Bergoglio except believe that the prayers of faithful Catholics will be heard.
I remind myself daily that we are in, and have always been in, a spiritual battle every day. This was true before Vatican II was even thought of. This was true before any of the wolves in the Church were born. Our duty and responsibility is to love God with all of our hearts, minds, and souls and to follow Christ which includes bearing our daily crosses. We know the Truth and it is the true that shall set us free.
Pray the Holy Rosary of St. Dominic every day. Live the Light of Christ and give testimony to the world of His love and pray for the understanding of all those who do not believe in Him, including the poor souls in the Church who have never been taught the true faith. Help to spread the true Gospel. Teach the true faith to your children and grandchildren. Correct anyone you speak to who is in error with the Truth and in love. If they will not listen, pray for them as they will send themselves to Hell if the Truth was heard and they refused to believe it. Do not worry about how God treats others; worry about how you treat God. Work to persevere in the faith because none of us knows the day or hour that we will be called before the Just Judge.
Louie,
«Sacrifice yourselves for sinners, and say many times, especially when you make some sacrifice: O Jesus, it is for love of You, for the conversion of sinners, and in reparation for the sins committed against the Immaculate Heart of Mary»
The English bishop William Kenney is a key figure in the official Catholic-Lutheran dialogue, and will be with Pope Francis in Sweden at the end of the month. He believes unity is a matter of decades away, and it’s very possible that Francis may use the trip to make a gesture on inter-communion.
https://cruxnow.com/interviews/2016/10/21/pope-sweden-break-ground-inter-communion-bishop-says/
Excerpt:
The consensus of the 1999 document on justification stated, if I’ve understood it correctly, that the reasons for the Catholics condemning the Protestant positions and vice-versa no longer hold, and if ever each Church did hold the position that the other said they did, what is now true is that neither Church no longer holds that position. In other words, the Reformation was all a big misunderstanding!
Bishop Kenney replied:
I think it’s very important that people know that the Reformation was a great misunderstanding, we all got it wrong, on both sides, and we’ve lifted excommunications and condemnations and apologized. So we can all be friends.
Of course, you’ll find certain Catholics and certain Lutherans still claiming the other holds those positions, but they are not representative of the mainstream positions of the Churches. The document was approved by Rome, which binds Catholics whether they like it or not; the Lutherans are made up of about 100 churches, and there were about 37 who didn’t, back then, sign up to it. Some have come into line since.
The only unity that is possible is unity with the principalities and powers and rulers of the darkness and looking back on the last 50 years and on all of the words and acts of those in the hierarchy, including the popes, one can see this is what has already occurred.
How the world would be prepared for the reign of the Antichrist is becoming clearer every day.
didn’t St Pul already address these issues ?
2Thess 2:15, “So then, brethren, stand firm, and hold the TRADITIONS that you have learned, whether by WORD or by LETTER of ours.”
Once again, ecumenism/ecumania is not “fruitless dialogue,” for one simple reason: its purpose is to dilute and weaken the Catholic Faith to the point where the Church fits it smoothly with the One World Religion, which is gnostic paganism with a few spiritual overtones and leftovers.
Therefore, considered from the perspective of its true purpose, ecumenism is quite successful.
I’ve just popped in to take a look at Louie’s recent posts and I see that nothing has changed in the comment section.
From Rushintuit: “It makes you irrational at the very least.” And this one of his/her milder comments. What is amazing about this comment section is how FAST things go down hill. Lots of little axes to grind, lots of personal judgement, lots of sedevacantists beating the same old drum, lots of uncharitable comments. Traditional Catholics (akaCatholics) already have the reputation as rude, uncharitable, intolerant cranks. Anyone dipping into the comments, down about 10 or so, finds the not so Catholic stuff.
What a shame as Louie’s posts are always thoughtful and interesting.
Thank you Catherine. Sometimes we behave as if Jesus was not aware of what is happening. He knew, knows, and will know every thought, word and deed of every single human person – from Adam to the last man standing. He is ALLOWING this crisis in His Church for US. This is the test. Do we remain faithful? Do we love our enemies and those who persecute us? Do we judge actions but never hearts?
In my humble opinion, this crisis has gone on for so long, with NO relief in sight because it appears almost everyone has lost his Faith – that we are losing our trust in Him. We are so frustrated! Why doesn’t HE do something!!!!!! They are getting away with it!!!!!
But if this is the test, what is our response? Again, in my humble opinion, we support good priests, and good bishops. Use bad teachings to learn good ones. Pray the Rosary. And influence those we are charged with influencing like family, friends, and neighbours. Constant carping and uncharitable talk will put us in danger of losing our own souls, and will not help bring the graces of conversion we so desperately need.
“For men are not bound, or able to read hearts; but when they see that someone is a heretic by his external works, they judge him to be a heretic pure and simple, and condemn him as a heretic.”
St Robert Bellarmine
“Ours is not to judge the interior disposition of Jorge Bergoglio’s soul. That’s Our Lord’s job.”
Louie Verecchio
Both statements are correct, but I think you miss the point Louie.
The Church is a visible institution. Therefore we can only operate on externals and make judgements about them. As laymen, our judgements are private and not binding on others. When the Church judges, Her judgements are binding on all.
So as laymen we can make a correct private judgement about Bergoglio.
That judgement is that he cannot possibly be the Pope, regardless of his interior dispostion.
It’s not about judging the interior disposition of Bergoglio’s soul
By your reasoning, St Vincent Ferrer was not a Catholic either.
Who are you trying to convince, and why?
Because it cuts both ways, the foundational principle is that a public heretic is outside the Church, and cannot hold any office or have any authority over Catholics.
The only exception is if Rushintoit says otherwise by his private judgement.
“As laymen, our judgements are private and not binding on others. When the Church judges, Her judgements are binding on all. So as laymen we can make a correct private judgement about Bergoglio.”
This is a twisted mind.
“And non sedevacantists make a private judgment that a pope is pope because they say so.”
Wrong again, Einstein! 99.98% of the entire world says the Pope is the Pope because he was validly elected Pope by the Cardinals. While 0.01% of mentally challenged sedes say, dat aint so.
Lamentations 4
…
4 Daleth. The tongue of the sucking child hath stuck to the roof of his mouth for thirst: the little ones have asked for bread, and there was none to break it unto them.
5 He. They that were fed delicately have died in the streets; they that were brought up in scarlet have embraced the dung.
6 Vau. And the iniquity of the daughter of my people is made greater than the sin of Sodom, which was overthrown in a moment, and hands took nothing in her.
7 Zain. Her Nazarites were whiter than snow, purer than milk, more ruddy than the old ivory, fairer than the sapphire.
8 Heth. Their face is now made blacker than coals, and they are not known in the streets: their skin hath stuck to their bones, it is withered, and is become like wood.
9 Teth. It was better with them that were slain by the sword, than with them that died with hunger: for these pined away being consumed for want of the fruits of the earth.
10 Jod. The hands of the pitiful women have sodden their own children: they were their meat in the destruction of the daughter of my people.
11 Caph. The Lord hath accomplished his wrath, he hath poured out his fierce anger: and he hath kindled a fire in Sion, and it hath devoured the foundations thereof.
12 Lamed. The kings of the earth, and all the inhabitants of the world would not have believed, that the adversary and the enemy should enter in by the gates of Jerusalem.
13 Mem. For the sins of her prophets, and the iniquities of her priests, that have shed the blood of the just in the midst of her. …
What matters personally is that we hold to the Faith once delivered, profess it, and extend charity to all those who are of the household of Faith, i.e. fellow Catholics, in submission to the legitimate pastors of the Church.
Avoiding the Novus Ordo and sacraments which are of doubtful validity goes without saying.
May God soon deliver the Church from the current crisis, and the impostor heretics who hate Him.
May He send us a true Pope.
Almost all of your comments contain an ad hominem.
I am unmoved.
The photo of Bergoglio giving a solemn “blessing” alongside a man whom he knows the Church has declared a layman in a costume, proves that Bergoglio doesn’t believe what Catholics believe.
He manifests his rejection of God’s truth in a variety of ways, by word and deed, which makes him a public heretic.
What a time to be alive.
We know this on this site, but most Catholics dont know this….and they believe that everything that comes out of his mouth is Catholic truth. For those people, the vast majority, we (the few who get it) are obligated to denounce him as a pope. When we (the few who get it) call him a pope all we do is add grease to the skids towards hell that almost all are on. It is my firm belief that if we fail to denounce him as a false pope, then we sin mortally….because if we dont denounce evil then we HATE the souls of those who are currently lost.
If Bergolio is Pope, then we should all assent to his Magesterial teachings, embrace his outreach to Lutherans, accept the Novus Ordo, stop trying to convert non-Catholics, and stop criticizing the concilior reforms. We have a duty to obey our Pope in both spiritual and temporal matters. After all the Pope is Christ’s Vicar on earth. If we can’t assent, we place ourselves outside. But, if Bergolio is not Pope and Vatican 2 was not a true council, then we can withhold our assent. It seems to me that the entire traditional community, including, rushintoit, has decided to withhold its assent to the teachings of the concilior church. If you believe the concilior church is the true church then you have excommunicated yourself by withholding assent.
BREAKING NEWS:
A flying saucer landed on the Mall in Washington D.C, this morning. An opening appeared and a ramp extended to the ground. A Bigfoot walked down the ramp carrying a sign that read, “There is no Pope”.
Stay tuned to this channel for any developments!
Dear Tom, Catholics are called to know the deposit of Faith, which never can change, from the age of reason. We are required to hold to the UNCHANGEABLE One True Faith – we may not depart from it, no matter who should encourage us to so do.
Yeah, and some other people keep telling their fellow Catholics that a pope can be put on trial for heresy. Can you imagine the lunacy?
Dont forget the headline, “Valid Ecumenical Council Teaches Error.”
I would believe in bigfoot and flying saucers before I could ever believe that the true church which Christ established could ever teach error.
Exactly, and the point that has me worried is that its actually the pope who is encouraging us to deviate. If that is true then he cant be the pope. How can he?
Christ is the same today as He was yesterday and is forever. Trust only in Christ and you will find peace. Hold onto to the Truth and Tradition known to you from your youth and you will not be troubled by the events of today.
Not much building up but a lot of tearing down. Satan is smiling as he creates divisions and disunity.